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What's your opinion about this wish?
Essential (5)
84%
 84%  [ 16 ]
Important (4)
15%
 15%  [ 3 ]
Average (3)
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Not important (2)
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Not needed (1)
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Average: 4.84 points
Total Votes : 19

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philips
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 12:12 am    Post subject: TYPE of windows and doors Reply with quote

WISH: Make defined "type" of doors, windows, skylights etc.

OK, for me this is extremely essential.

STORY:
At the moment I'm working on a residential project of 500 apartments (35 apartments layout definitions) in 3 buildings, 40 000 sqm. Each building is divided into 2-6 hotlinks populated on 10 stories, external walls are outside hotlinks.
There are 5 architects working on this project using Teamwork project, hotlinks are PLNs.
There are more than 2500 windows and 4000 doors (including 2 story garage). At the moment we have something like 7 door types and 11 window types ( that is approximately 350 items each type) defined in Favorites.

Although Favorites are really handy they don't really do the job needed to have full control on what is happening with those basic for every projects elements.

The problem appears when it comes to change some door or window parameters of the same "type". It is nearly impossible to do it without a mistake. There is always someone having some walls reserved, not sended changes or simply someone changed some parameter of the door/window making it impossible to select it by the Find palette. Selecting all doors or windows in 3D sometimes works really slow since there are many elements to be shown in 3D (even when hiding in layer the rest of the model except walls) and not always is possible for several reasons.
Changes to all doors/windows of one type is usually made "by hand".......ughrrrr.

Also defining in AC the ID as "type" name is rather a strange way to work with windows/doors and in fact not working in most of the time or requiring to many workarounds.

Most architects think of door / windows using "types" of them, not individual items. A TYPE of door / window is something natural in any projects bigger then a small house.

SOLUTION:

Make an option to define door / window parameter set for a particular door/window TYPE, exactly as Favorites, but..... after inserting those items they are only a copy of this defined "type".... just as a Autocad block / Revit Family / Sketchup Component etc.


REQUIREMENTS / SUGGESTIONS:
- The TYPE has its own name allowing to select windows/door by the TYPE
- Any changes to the defined window / door TYPE takes effect in all items of this type placed in the project, no matter if they are reserved or not.
- Teamwork: each Type definition has to be reserved before changing its parameters
- this TYPE could be a part of Favorites palette for simplicity, or maybe a separate palette (?)
- maybe some parameters could be changed within types - for instance left/right doors are still the same TYPE.
- schedules work with TYPEs (selecting, quantities etc)
- editing TYPE of window / door "in place" so working with one door takes effect in the whole project including hotlinks
- TYPE definitions can be exported to other projects and hotlinks (!!!) by the Attribute Manager (or simple export in the TYPE Palette).


I can't imagine Archicad in the future without TYPEs (or whatever you call it). This is in my opinion a "must have".
Its not necessary to have TYPES when working on project even with 200 windows, but when it comes to thousands the window type becomes a major problem.
Architects industry is changing, projects become bigger and more complex every year. Grouping elements into inteligent hierarchy is what AC will have to deal with as soon as possible. TYPEs is the first but not last, big step.
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alemanda
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 8:17 am    Post subject: Re: TYPE of windows and doors Reply with quote

I think there is a way to save what you call a "type".
Now it's a little bit difficult to achieve perhaps.

You should open the lybrary part, for example "window 18.gsm", edit manually all the parameters in the gdl editor and save that library part as new one, for example "window type 1.gsm"

It's a sort of making a "snapshot" of the parameters you want to use for that object.

A good step forward in this direction would be the chance to save all the parameters of a "type" on a xml file and recall from object user interface, like "call parameters from a file" button.

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alemanda
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 8:27 am    Post subject: Re: TYPE of windows and doors Reply with quote

Another suggestion (for implementation by GS) would be to set a permanent/non permanent link between the favourite and the library part. So if you change the favourite parameters all the library parts linked to that favourite change as well ...
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philips
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 8:53 am    Post subject: Re: TYPE of windows and doors Reply with quote

alemanda wrote:
I think there is a way to save what you call a "type".
Now it's a little bit difficult to achieve perhaps.

You should open the lybrary part, for example "window 18.gsm", edit manually all the parameters in the gdl editor and save that library part as new one, for example "window type 1.gsm"

It's a sort of making a "snapshot" of the parameters you want to use for that object.

A good step forward in this direction would be the chance to save all the parameters of a "type" on a xml file and recall from object user interface, like "call parameters from a file" button.


Workaround, workaround, workaround.... to many of them Smile

A snapshot of library element parameters is what I initially was thinking of , just a simple place to save and load XML file and ability to have window / doors to "read" those parameters.
Now I think it should have a functionality much more complex and built into the core of AC, excalty like the Renovation Tool.
Except windows, doors, skylights, curtains etc it could be used for furniture layouts and other sort of objects cloned all over the project. Potencially there are several situation a TYPE tool could be used in all stages of design.

Coming back to workarounds. For me a workaround is not a tool or solution, its a temporary option to make a thing and forget as soon as possible how was it done.
But your suggestion is very valueble, for the moment propable the best thing I can try, thanks Alemanda!
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Vahur
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 8:34 pm    Post subject: Re: TYPE of windows and doors Reply with quote

alemanda wrote:
I think there is a way to save what you call a "type".
Now it's a little bit difficult to achieve perhaps.

You should open the lybrary part, for example "window 18.gsm", edit manually all the parameters in the gdl editor and save that library part as new one, for example "window type 1.gsm"

It's a sort of making a "snapshot" of the parameters you want to use for that object.

A good step forward in this direction would be the chance to save all the parameters of a "type" on a xml file and recall from object user interface, like "call parameters from a file" button.

Oh yes, this is a great option when you are working alone with only one version of AC. I promise you, migration will be PAINFUL Twisted Evil

But the idea of "types" is just GREAT Exclamation Exclamation Exclamation In our country it is demanded to make spec of doors/windows in every project. Every door/window must have a name/number which refers to particular element properties.
For example window called AS-03F must be:
1400x1200, opening inside, white color, triple glass, EI30, 42 dB, have child lock. I need this code "AS-03F" attached to every that kind of window. It must be easily attached and visible in drawings. Seems like favorites can to this, but indeed they cant. They work only in one direction: Choose favorite>apply properties. There is no way to change properties of elements by changing favorites.

There is a much more complex hierarchy in AC: Line type>Fill>Material>Composite (optional Surface). If you change the particular fill, it will automatically change in all the instances of composites, which is using material with that kind of fill.
The same idea can be used here. Simple!


Last edited by Vahur on Tue Apr 14, 2015 8:01 am; edited 1 time in total
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Barry Kelly
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2015 3:40 am    Post subject: Re: TYPE of windows and doors Reply with quote

Vahur wrote:

There is no way to change properties of elements by changing favorites.


True but if you have the type parameter in your door/window objects you can create a schedule that shows that parameter.
It can then be edited directly in the schedule.

You can even use the schedules as an advanced Find & Select.
Set up a schedule to find all windows that are - 1400x1200, opening inside, white colour, triple glass - use these as your search criteria.
Add a field that shows the 'Type' parameter and then you can edit them all to be the code that you want - either directly in the schedule (one by one) or you can highlight all of the windows in the schedule and use the 'show and select in plan or 3D' buttons to select all the windows and edit the parameter at once for all selected windows.

Now you can just change the selection criteria to find other window types.

Not the most elegant solution but until we get the option to Find & Select by object parameters this will have to do.

Barry.

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Vahur
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2015 8:21 am    Post subject: Re: TYPE of windows and doors Reply with quote

Barry Kelly wrote:
Vahur wrote:

There is no way to change properties of elements by changing favorites.


True but if you have the type parameter in your door/window objects you can create a schedule that shows that parameter.
It can then be edited directly in the schedule.

You can even use the schedules as an advanced Find & Select.
Set up a schedule to find all windows that are - 1400x1200, opening inside, white colour, triple glass - use these as your search criteria.
Add a field that shows the 'Type' parameter and then you can edit them all to be the code that you want - either directly in the schedule (one by one) or you can highlight all of the windows in the schedule and use the 'show and select in plan or 3D' buttons to select all the windows and edit the parameter at once for all selected windows.

Now you can just change the selection criteria to find other window types.

Not the most elegant solution but until we get the option to Find & Select by object parameters this will have to do.

Barry.

Yes, it helps to find and select, but this is another topic. This topic is not about finding, this is about changing elements properties without finding and selecting all of them. Some kind of advanced favorites.

Also there must be a name for preset, which could be shown in window/door marker. Currently there can be ID, but it has internal counter and can be changed or deleted while you edit an element. But if we compare to wall, the name of the composite cannot be changed when you change the wall's properties.
ID cannot be used for this purpose. If you insert a window with ID W-1 the next you insert will have ID W-2. W-3, W-4 etc.... This is a headache.
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Barry Kelly
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2015 10:38 am    Post subject: Re: TYPE of windows and doors Reply with quote

Vahur wrote:

ID cannot be used for this purpose. If you insert a window with ID W-1 the next you insert will have ID W-2. W-3, W-4 etc.... This is a headache.


Not if you don't want it to.
Turn off the Auto ID Increase checkbox in the Options > Project Preferences > Miscellaneous dialog box.

Barry.

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Erwin Edel
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2015 12:12 pm    Post subject: Re: TYPE of windows and doors Reply with quote

Ages ago we 'solved' this by loads and loads of modules of bits of wall with windows. Also tedious. This idea is solid, TYPEs. I like it Smile

Favourites tend to included story, reveal settings etc etc, which might not actually be intended to change, just the actual window/door.

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Vahur
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2015 4:17 pm    Post subject: Re: TYPE of windows and doors Reply with quote

Barry Kelly wrote:

Not if you don't want it to.
Turn off the Auto ID Increase checkbox in the Options > Project Preferences > Miscellaneous dialog box.

Barry.

There is no such menu at this location, tried all profiles, including standard.
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