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Einar Wahlstrøm
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:11 pm    Post subject: Curved ceiling Reply with quote

Hi.

I’m a long time ArchiCad user but I can’t find a good solution for these two dilemmas:

A)
A curved ceiling made up out of thin wooden beams (image).
The problem is not to model this, but how to effectively change the curvature during design phase without having to model it over and over again. I’m aware that a Rhino-Grasshopper connection could solve this parametrically (a controlling spline and all the beams perpendicular to this) but is a similar solution possible within ArchiCad?

B)
I have been looking in-and-out of the web for a north-arrow/3D-sun object that shows the angle of the sun as a line in 3D based on the global sun-settings. Does anybody know of such an object or add-on?

All comments greatly appreciated.

Einar Wahlstrøm MNAL
w: www.personligarkitektur.no



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Steve Jepson
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 3:51 am    Post subject: Re: Curved ceiling Reply with quote

A) since there are so many ways you can quickly model it, why do you need to keep it adjustable? Tweak the complex profile per a spline you draw in a section seems like a good way to get the exact curves you want. When ever I tweak a curved complex profile I use a wall and the magic wand to follow the spline. Then explode the wall and consolidate the fills. Then use that fill in the complex profiler.

B) That other program (which must not be named) has exactly what your looking for for Smile Sometimes I use the compass which can also be displayed in 3D and a column to cast a shadow line in 3D. Azimuth is displayed in Perspective Settings and there is a sun symbol with a line across the model area in a preview window with the camera.

This would be a good request for the next version of ArchiCAD. It can't be very hard to make a GDL Sun Compass. Everyone would like to have something like that. I have a sun compass app on my phone.
http://www.suncompass.info/howtouse.htm



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Einar Wahlstrøm
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 9:50 am    Post subject: Re: Curved ceiling Reply with quote

Hi and thanks for the reply.

A) I'm not sure I understand your solution entirely. How do you tweak a complex profile via a spline in section view?

Just as a test I tried making a curved ceiling as a complex profile and have the wooden beams follow a spline, but it's not entirely correct. The beams don't align themselves tangential to the spline.


B)
I have found a GDL Object that kind of does what I want, but not entirely.

http://www.thebimstore.com/bim-products/gdl-objects/compass.html



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Last edited by Einar Wahlstrøm on Sun Oct 01, 2017 5:28 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Gops
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 3:45 pm    Post subject: Curved ceiling Reply with quote

Compass:

You can try this one from Archiradar:
Quote:
https://www.archiradar.it/en/3d-objects/free-objects/viewcategory/13-various-objects-oggetti-vari.html


P.S: It would seems that the solar path object from Archiradar works only for the Northern hemisphere. As I am in the Southern hemisphere could a GDL guru look into the issue?

Thanks

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Steve Jepson
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 6:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Curved ceiling Reply with quote

Einar Wahlstrøm wrote:
Hi and thanks for the reply.

A) I'm not sure I understand your solution entirely. How do you tweak a complex profile via a spline in section view?


You can't.

Are you using the new methods for distribution/multiply along a spline that we can do in 21 now? This might be a little different than before.

I don't think you can make a 3D object you can adjust like a spline for new curves, other than the limited way you can do it with a morph. If you convert that Profile to a Morph you can adjust its curves with Box Stretch if that helps.

If your were to use a morph that is just a single part you could use the Box Stretch to adjust the curve in 3D, but not with all of the control you probably need.

You can probably make a new Profile with the new curves/spline faster than you can model each part individually. By update the Profile I just mean that you open it, paste in the new fills and save it again.
This does not make anything adjustable in 3D like you would adjust a Spline, but I don't know why that kind of adjustment would be important other than for instant 3D visualizations. Wouldn't you prefer to have it modeled per some thing more constructible and documentable than free-form? You will want to make those curves to some dinmensionable path. Some arch and pivot points that you can show in a detail. Something the builder can reproduce on the jobsite exactly per plan.

I think the solution will be in finding a clever way to model it rather than finding an element you can adjust in a 3D view.

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Last edited by Steve Jepson on Sun Oct 01, 2017 8:13 pm; edited 3 times in total
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Einar Wahlstrøm
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 7:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Curved ceiling Reply with quote

Steve Jepson wrote:

I think the solution will be in finding a clever way to model it rather than finding an element you can adjust in a 3D view.


Yes, you are right. It will be buildt at some point and has to be reproduced on site. However the real size of these curves makes me think that it can be printed and traced on site, rather than reproduced with a ruler and compass.

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Steve Jepson
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 8:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Curved ceiling Reply with quote

Idea of a stretchable 3d part to help see what the approximate shape/curve should be is valid. It seems like there should be an object out there that would do this. The only solution to that I have would be to convert that beam or wall Profile in to a morph and stretch that around. The down side to that is that it's too late:) If you already made a Profile for that ceiling you don't need a toy to help you figure out the curves of the ceiling.

In this image are two Profiles saved as beam and wall and converted to a morph so they can be stretched with the Morph Box Stretch.

You probably don't have the time, but it would be nice to see how the ceiling turns out. How it as attached, what's behind it, that sort of thing...


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Einar Wahlstrøm
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 8:20 pm    Post subject: Re: Curved ceiling Reply with quote

Thanks Steve.

I have just sent a request to ArchiRadar and asked them if they could help me making a GDL object that does this. My initial though was a tweak of an existing object which is a bit similar.

Above the ceiling there will be acoustic absorbents.



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Steve Jepson
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 8:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Curved ceiling Reply with quote

initially I thought the curves you were talking about were going the other way, like this.


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Steve Jepson
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 8:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Curved ceiling Reply with quote

what you want to do is something more like this where the wood is perpendicular to the curves - right?


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