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User avatar
By Josh CSNZ
#321503
I'm not sure if I'm using the correct workflow.
I have a sloping site (mesh), I have used a slab and performed a SEO to create a flat building platform.
I then need to add level dimensions to indicate what the proposed levels are.
When I use the level dimension tool, the dimensions only return the original heights, not the new cut heights.

This seems like a silly question, but can the level dimension tool be used to dimension the levels of a cut+fill site?
Or is it a case that we can not (should not) use the SEO to cut meshes?

I'm hoping I'm just using the tools incorrectly.

Thanks in advance for any assistance.
Attachments
Example of mesh with SEO cut
Example of mesh with SEO cut
image005.png (240.82 KiB) Viewed 299 times
Example showing original level Dimensions
Example showing original level Dimensions
image006.png (14.52 KiB) Viewed 299 times
User avatar
By Josh CSNZ
#321507
A follow-up query would be how to show the actual mesh in plan view.
Currently, it shows as a green rectangle, whereas I would have expected to see something that resembled the new shape of the mesh.

Something like in the image below.
Site cut plan.png
Site cut plan.png (33.57 KiB) Viewed 292 times
User avatar
By Barry Kelly
#321519
Solid Element Operations do not show in floor plan views.
That is why you will not be able to dimension them there either.

You could try converting the mesh into a morph.
Then you will see the cuts in plan.
I would keep a copy of the original mesh in a hidden layer so you can edit it as needed.
Sometimes it is not so easy to edit the morph as you want.


Barry.
User avatar
By Lingwisyer
#321615
Or you could use another mesh as your SOE operator using subtraction with upwards extrusion, then dimension that mesh instead?



Ling.
User avatar
By Josh CSNZ
#321691
Thanks for the feedback guys. Guess we'll keep plodding along with workarounds for now.

This is one of the aspects of Archicad (and other packages too) that surprises me.
It seems like such a fundamental requirement for documenting the construction of a building (the ability to be able to document siteworks, before the building is even established).
Yet the tools aren't up to the task.

A mesh tool that doesn't display in plan view, the way it does in all other views.
A level dimension tool that can't return the dimension level of the element it's associated too.

How does something like this get overlooked for so long?
User avatar
By Barry Kelly
#321697
Josh CSNZ wrote: Thu Jan 28, 2021 11:16 pm A mesh tool that doesn't display in plan view, the way it does in all other views.
A level dimension tool that can't return the dimension level of the element it's associated too.

The mesh tool does display in the plan view as it does in the other views.
It is the Solid Element Operation that does not show.

If you edit the mesh by adding contours and adjusting levels, or in the example you show, cut a hole and add another mesh inside, you will see exactly what you want and you can use the level dimension tool.


Barry.
User avatar
By James B
#321751
To cut into a Mesh, you could also try to use the Opening Tool (added in AC23).
Which you'll see on the Floor Plan.

I made a video early last year, you can skip towards the end.
User avatar
By Josh CSNZ
#321848
Barry Kelly wrote: Fri Jan 29, 2021 1:52 am
Josh CSNZ wrote: Thu Jan 28, 2021 11:16 pm A mesh tool that doesn't display in plan view, the way it does in all other views.
A level dimension tool that can't return the dimension level of the element it's associated too.

The mesh tool does display in the plan view as it does in the other views.
It is the Solid Element Operation that does not show.

If you edit the mesh by adding contours and adjusting levels, or in the example you show, cut a hole and add another mesh inside, you will see exactly what you want and you can use the level dimension tool.


Barry.
Hi Barry

Thanks for your response and I hear what you're saying.
The point I was trying to make, is that in the elevations, sections, perspectives, 3D documents etc it is the mesh that is showing, not the SEO and it all looks as expected and intended.
It is the plan view that is the odd one out. One would expect the plan view to reflect.
In the Elevations, Sections etc, we are seeing the surface of the mesh using the defined settings of that surface, where the mesh is cut we see the building material of the mesh with its defined settings.

3D View
3D View.png
3D View.png (484.33 KiB) Viewed 148 times
3D Document
3D Document.png
3D Document.png (55.35 KiB) Viewed 148 times
Elevation
Elevation.png
Elevation.png (41.43 KiB) Viewed 148 times
Section
Section.png
Section.png (28.66 KiB) Viewed 148 times
User avatar
By Josh CSNZ
#321849
Plan View I was expecting
Plan View Expected.png
Plan View Expected.png (25.09 KiB) Viewed 148 times
Plan view we get
Plan View Reality.png
Plan View Reality.png (7.07 KiB) Viewed 148 times
Whilst the workarounds of drawing elements over can work it's not an efficient workflow.

In order to see the cut + fill in plan view as described you need to have SEO on and set the cover fill to match that of the element you are trying to indicate. Kind of drawing a fill over it.
The idea of not using SEOs and instead drawing new contours achieves a few requirements but then fails on others. New contours instead of SEOs would then mean you are limited to one surface, you can't then show the cut areas as earth/soil. Also the new contours are not often known. In the "Plan View Expected" above, we can see where the contours should be as the SEO has already been curved on the downward slope region, trying to work this out thou without SEOs would be time consuming.

As described earlier with the level dimesnion tool and setting the SEO to zero thickness means you can't batter edges as I have done on above examples.

I'm very grateful for the assistance, my frustration is more at how the software can't show the operations (not to be confused with operators) in plan view.

Why would we want to have an object appear in all other views as "operated on". But in plan view have zero ability to represent it's true shape?
User avatar
By Josh CSNZ
#321850
James B wrote: Fri Jan 29, 2021 5:40 pm To cut into a Mesh, you could also try to use the Opening Tool (added in AC23).
Which you'll see on the Floor Plan.

I made a video early last year, you can skip towards the end.
Thanks James, I didn't realise the opening tool worked on meshes as well.
I think this will work in some situations.
You can't batter edges (angle/slope) or curve in plan view thou I think.