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Moderators: ejrolon, Barry Kelly, Karl Ottenstein, LaszloNagy, gkmethy

Allow the Beam tool to be free-rotated?

I need this!
5
63%
Could be useful.
3
38%
Not needed.
No votes
0%
By DGSketcher
#307730
Why do we need it? It is currently possible to free-rotate in 3D the Curtain Wall, Shell & Morph tools. As the new AC23 column and beam tools are already on divergent paths, I would propose that the more flexible beam tool is given the ability to be freely rotated in 3D. Obviously it would retain it's planar nature, but I see this as a good compromise to allow for the creation of flexible columns. Basic examples which many of us are familiar with are the vertical drain stacks, stove flues, ventilation pipes and service conduits all of which typically require an offset or change of direction and sweeping bends.

Why not just draw with the Beam tool on plan and then convert to Morph and rotate? Well, apart from the act of having to create the morph and retaining the original form somewhere hidden in the drawing in case it needs editing, the Morph looses all parametric data and becomes a major challenge to edit in place if the original is lost. Yes you can create these forms directly with the Morph tool, but you still have the challenge of editing curved forms, which the Morph is notoriously bad at handling.

Is this too much of a geometric challenge for the developers? I don't think so, there are already three tools delivering free-rotate complex geometry to the drawing process, and if I convert the beam to a morph, the same connection issues occur in the rest of the model irrespective of the source.
By Braza
#307733
I know it is not the same, but can't you achieve similar result changing the pitch of the Beam?
Or perhaps I am missing your point. :?:
By DGSketcher
#307735
My favourite beam frustrations...

1. Beams can only be inclined to 89 degrees :(

2. You need to form a series of "chained" beams in order to form the curves, but you can't incline that group

3. You can't fillet a node in a single beam to form a curve.

As far as I am aware columns can't have curves. This is why Beams & Columns should have been merged. :roll:
By Braza
#307800
1. I understand your frustration, specially with the holistic/minimalistic view you would like to have in Archicad tools;

2. Doesn't the new beam tool allow curved segments? (I am still with AC22);

3. I am not visualizing it. Could you develop on this?;
By DGSketcher
#307811
Ahh, I see we are a version apart! :)

The new beam tool is a clever development, a huge advance even if the bugs are still being fixed, it is pretty stable and I am working with it every day.

Unfortunately Graphisoft have always separated beams and columns by limiting beam inclines to < 89 degrees from horizontal and columns as > 1 degree from horizontal. Which in my book, even as an old hand, is a bit archaic in modern software. So although you can create complex shapes, including curves, by chaining beams together with the new tool, as soon as they are chained they can’t be inclined, neither can an isolated curved segment. It just seems like they have developed a fantastic linear element tool, but missed that it would be very useful to freely rotate the beam in 3D without having to resort to converting it to a morph and loosing all the parametric data in the process.

Does that help? It is difficult to appreciate the potential of this new tool if you haven’t played with it.
By Braza
#307812
I see... Perhaps if you challenge Barry for a "New Beam Tool Contest" you may have what you are looking for. :lol:
By DGSketcher
#307815
Ok, nothing exciting, just a set of identical grouped beams with different profiles applied to show how important the parametric can be...
Attachments
Screenshot 2020-03-02 at 18.14.32.png
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By mnguyen
#307909
Hi All,

Thank you very much for creating this poll, and for those of you who voted to express their opinion.

I am happy to say we took notice of this wish and I have added it into our WishList database (please refer to it in the future as Wish #12659). Hopefully, our Product Management team will adopt this one in the future.

Thank you all once more, and I wish you a great day!

Best regards,
Minh
By DGSketcher
#307937
That’s good news! Thanks. I don’t expect it will be in AC24, will it? :D